Considering Funding Sources
by PMHC Project Coordinator 2:57pm, 14 July 2009
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Redevelopment of Timbertown has been estimated at a cost of $15 million. Council wants your ideas on meeting these initial redevelopment costs and the potential structure to ensure ongoing financial stability of the park. How should the initial redevelopment costs be funded? How Should Council ensure the ongoing financial stability of Timbertown?
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HappyHammer Comment 1
4:33pm, 15 July 2009
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To ensure the quality of the re-development it should be managed by someone with a stake in its future. I don't know what council funded roles exist at Timbertown today but I would suggest a full time role be created and funded to manage the re-development and continue to manage the park once complete.
If the decision is made to re-develop then once the funding is secured this role could be advertised immediately and the best candidate chosen to manage the project and the park once operational.
To avoid cost over-runs this person should have proven Project Management and operational management ability and have the authority to negotiate fixed price contracts for the re-development.
This role would have control of how the park is operated and the brand is promoted. This would be after consultation with stakeholders in the park and signed off by the council.
This role would also own the ongoing maintenance and improvement plan and should continue the community consultation. You'll never please everyone but sometimes good ideas can be found and supported through consultation.
HappyHammer Comment 2
9:51am, 16 July 2009
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The re-development should include options that enable Timbertown to generate income to be put back into the Park, with an aim, however difficult it is to achieve, of being self funding at some point in the future.
Areas that could be considered are:
Timber Sales (as per post elsewhere on this forum)
Increased entrance fees
Rental of retail outlets wihin Timbertown OR
Timbertown monthly market with reduced entry fee
Park to retain ownership of more profitable elements of the park (food & drink?)
Marketing plan to get people through the gates
School group and tour group concessions
etc.....
strawb Comment 2.1
10:23am, 17 July 2009
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NO to Increased entry fees - we've already been there done that - it was a disaster which led to T/T's previous closure. A portion of gate takings should be guaranteed to upgrading exhibits and the development of new ones. We need new attactractions to attract tourist back...
HappyHammer Comment 2.1.1
12:12pm, 17 July 2009
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I think they'll have to be lifted from where they are now. For a time we had the quaint but unrealistic option of leaving a donation. If the park is to be brought into the 21st century and then maintain its allure money will be required on an ongoing basis.
The cost of entry is measured on value for money, if the re-development is done well and offers more attractions then this is an opportunity for the fee to reflect this as long as it is value for money. All of this is said on the assumption that the gate fees will be used exclusively for the park and no other council venture.
strawb Comment 2.1.1.1
7:59pm, 20 July 2009
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The donation bit was ages ago and well if the gate money was going back into the park, we would not have the issues we have now, alas like all government entities (although council technically isn't government) they will milk a cash cow until it falls over and then wonder what happened... I expect (and from on the ground experience) that a small portion of gate takings "may" find their way back to improve things (other than the front shop) I don't have high hopes...
important history Comment 2.1.2
11:31am, 4 August 2009
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The fee is currently well below any other heritage parks in Australia this includes static diplays - all the gate takings should be put back into the park, if locals bought yearly passes they would make great savings were else can you visit for $20 for a family of 4???
strawb Comment 3
10:19am, 17 July 2009
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The overall topic of funding sources should be viewed in the light that the current sources have been wasted or more to the point not satisfactorily utilised. This situation needs to be addressed first before the decline can be arrested.
The problem that has caused the decline in Timbertown’s exhibits has been that the management is too top heavy, overpaid and achieve very little on the ground. The focus has been predominantly on the front shop and very little in the way of upgrading (repairing) existing infrastructure.
The most damning of all was the inability of a certain council officer to negotiate even the handing over (purchase or status quo) of accreditation for the THSR narrow gauge railway from B.Guest - this seriously undermines T/T's ability to attract tourists and this is currently the single most important issue to rectify. If the revenue stream is left at its current rate T/T's fate is already sealed. Or was that the purpose of stopping the train so that council would not have to make a decision?
We need to ensure that people who are paid to promote the park actually perform this role to a higher standard than previously.
There needs to be a streamlining of how exhibits are built in the park, a volunteer should not have to worry about BA/DAs in the park and certainly, they should not have to pay a lease when they are providing a display. In this regard - I'm referring to the machinery sheds.
I would expect council to approach the state government for additional funding as T/T is an important Tourist destination (now the Hastings only one) and in addition important heritage value as many items in the park no longer exist anywhere else.
getreal Comment 3.1
2:53pm, 20 July 2009
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I agree displays should not have to pay a lease providing they are just that. Open everyday, not sheds closed up. They should contain attractions not all your personel junk that does not fit in the back shed at home.
Apart from chopping trees down and becoming Wauchope's self storage facility. Most of the current issues are not all exactly councils. It's hard to soar like an eagle when you work with turkey's. Repeat after me. More give, less take. More give, less take. Too many business's and or attractions are paying peppercorn rents and expect the world from council as well. The one option for funding that has not been explored above is selling the park as a ongoing concern. I am sure peole would fear the park could close and be redeveloped but there are procedures that could be in place to prevent this. Very best of luck in acquiring funding from a local government that is broke, a state government that is broke and a federal government that is more interested in the Asian Pacific region than the north coast of NSW. And just remember the current admisson price for a family is less than a movie ticket and that's not to mention the hundreds of free loaders using the back entrance to avoid paying a minor fee at the front gate which helps the park continue to run.
Also people should bare in mind if council do follow all these forum ideas and turn it into a world class theme park, with world class attractions that could only be viable if 95% of people currently using the park for business or pleasure or just a free BBQ lunch are gone.
Perhaps concerned tenants should ask council where there future lies if this world class attraction comes about.
strawb Comment 3.1.1
8:17pm, 20 July 2009
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Removed by moderator - the comment named an individual.
Craig Swift-McNair Comment 3.2
Manager, Business Services
2:35pm, 22 July 2009
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Council would like to clarify the comments made about the Timbertown Steam Railway.
Because the train is run in NSW, it must comply with standards set down by the Independent Transport Safety & Reliability Regulator (ITSRR). The accreditation that is given by ITSRR is not given to one individual, it is given to a company or organisation and it is not transferable from one body to the other.
Council could not buy or have transferred accreditation for the train as it is simply not allowed according to the regulations and ITSRR. There is further detail on this issue in the frequently asked questions section of the site.
hudswell-clarke Comment 3.2.1
11:16am, 8 August 2009
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As I understand it, there would be nothing to stop Council or the Timbertown Company (wholly owned by Council) becoming the accredited operator of this major attraction at Timbertown. Assistance with the necessary paperwork could be sought from an existing operator, such as Zig Zag Railway at Lithgow. The other major problem for a contract operator would be public liability insurance. Surely this would be one to be included in Timbertown's overall policy, as would the saw mill and other attractions within the complex.
JVO Comment 4
2:49pm, 20 July 2009
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Given the level of funding needed to make the park at all sustainable there would need to be State or Federal funding
rani Comment 5
12:07am, 28 July 2009
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I have two questions to put to Craig Swift-McNair, Manager Business Services. Question 1. I understood the land on which Timbertown was built, was given to the Hastings SHIRE Council in the early 70s by the then Forestry Commission for the express purpose of building a timber-themed heritage park and nothing else. Has this changed? When did it change? Is the land now owned by Council without any restrictions?
Question 2. If Timbertown is closed completely and the land used for another purpose (if this is, in fact, permitted under the original transfer of title from Forestry to Hastings Shire Council) what then will happen to all the equipment and historic items that were DONATED IN GOOD FAITH by people (myself included) from all over the mid north coast and beyond to be used in a timber-themed heritage park at Wauchope?
bowen Comment 6
10:09am, 5 August 2009
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If Council were to make a definitive decision on the future of Timbertown then funding source suggestions would not seem so futile. As I understand it the scope for federal or state grants is dependent on Council meeting the financial commitment on a dollar for dollar basis which they are not in a position to do and, so, are unable to apply for grants. As the community has such passion for Timbertown would it not be more sensible to commit to keeping the park open, apply for grant money, and ask the community for help in matching the dollar for dollar amount voluntarily as opposed to any increase in rates.
